It's all about that magic little r.... mRs... that's what I talking about.
Or rather, what this column in the NYT expresses. My ranting is just, well, my ranting ;)
We all know it, although some of us are obviously trying more that others to avoid the discussion. The single woman, turns unmarried and then implication "poor little one, she never got picked and now shes beoynd the child bearing years so it's definetly over" [since women are mainly attractive when they can bear children, their man's children, and after that it would mainly be about something else... mutual attraction? heh.].
And this still when people know that stating to a guy when you start dating that you are "interested in your own career, not sure on children - but if there are children we'd split evenly when it comes to child rearing, by the way - I want my own money and not just yours" in short - being ambitious, is the biggest gamble ever. I know there are men out there who are OK with this, I'm just saying as in narrowing the field, that's a lot of narrowing...
Do you know how many times it all turned to quiet when I said I was a graduate student on a first date? (let's believe for a minute I am fairly attractive and not hideous.) Or when I mentioned that I knew I wanted to go abroad for my post doc? (not to mention the lovely post doc who told us grad students that "post doc times are great for brining the wife to have children while you build your papers and research career". Oh I wished I was a man then and there.)
I have to say though, it's never been as obvious as here in the US that there is another perception out there; single older person = gay. It seems to be the way people interpret most of these "powerful people who are unmarried". I mean, divorced means a failure, but they still tried out the heterosexual marriage deal. (If you don't believe this wonderful distinction, let's look at dating sites where you can choose between "never married, divorced, widow" as a status.)
It's still one of those prickly things in me. As a woman, once I have gone from Miss to Mrs I can never go back... as divorced you can choose by taking Mrs or the Ms... a newer invention apparently? Being Mrs with your maiden name sounds like your mother, being Mrs with your old married name just sounds like you are still married (imho). (I am referring without the children here, although the number of times I have heard women going "I'm staying with his name since the children have it and it's easier that way" so they are still the Mrs Married although the papers are signed and it's over.)
It's nice when you can avoid the whole discussion and dive for the Dr. "Are you Miss, Ms or Mrs? oh, Dr you say"... Obvious pit fall on having a non-obvious female name in US, would be numerous letters addressed to Mr Chall... duh. Although, at least it is easy to weed out commercial and non-personal correspondance. But I did get annoyed when my frequent flyer miles place sent something out to Mr Chall, I mean - I have an account with them.
6 comments:
Gosh Chall, haven't you figured out yet that unless you have children and are married, you as a woman have no worth. Where's Zuska so I can go puke on someone's shoes with her. I would post a whole this issue, except I have that whole mtg to set comp date 6 weeks from now.....
SM. I know you aren't right ( ;) ) but sometimes I'd need that reminder....
Ah yes, it is still a man's world. I sometimes think that the biggest culprits of sterotypes are women. Despite the advances we have made, some women are still stuck in the days of our grandmothers.
Being able to use Dr instead is soooooo awesome! One of the main perks of the title, and I'm being serious here.
Men don't have to even think about this. I pointed this out to my husband once when he was teasing me for insisting on being called Dr, and asked how he would feel if the title he used revealed information to strangers about his marital status and/or attitude to same. He sees my point now - and doesn't tease me quite so often when I answer "is it Miss or Mrs?" with "actually, it's Doctor".
On forms that don't include Dr or Other, I usually go for Ms because Mrs just sounds WRONG on me. I've never used it because I got married after I got my PhD, and Mrs [surname] sounds like someone waaaay older than me. Mrs [surname] is my mother-in-law, after all... she's lovely, but I don't see myself as being anywhere near the same generation!
Girlpostdoc: oh you are so right about that. Sometimes I have to repeat to myself "but we're suppose to be in this together".
Cath: So no Mrs Cath ;) I love that fact in one sense here in the South though, the Ms firstname woman as the children call me. I know I could say it's Dr Chall but it's more of a polite thing of Ms Frist name and Mr First name together with Sir and Maam of course.
I still wonder about the Maam, but I look older than 20 which seem to be some kind of cut off?! ;)
Do you remember reading books from the 50ies when younger married woen were referred to as "young Mrs X" as a comparison to Mrs X, her mother in law ;) (it's easier with Dr)
Girlpostdoc: oh you are so right about that. Sometimes I have to repeat to myself "but we're suppose to be in this together".
Cath: So no Mrs Cath ;) I love that fact in one sense here in the South though, the Ms firstname woman as the children call me. I know I could say it's Dr Chall but it's more of a polite thing of Ms Frist name and Mr First name together with Sir and Maam of course.
I still wonder about the Maam, but I look older than 20 which seem to be some kind of cut off?! ;)
Do you remember reading books from the 50ies when younger married woen were referred to as "young Mrs X" as a comparison to Mrs X, her mother in law ;) (it's easier with Dr)
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